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<DATE>2013-12-13</DATE>
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<NAME>Susie Lorand</NAME>
<RESP>MURP</RESP>
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<IDG S="marc" R="UM" ID="B21542">
<STC T="W">E129</STC>
<BIBNO T="oclc">[ocm]11209887</BIBNO>
<VID>204909</VID>
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<TEXT LANG="eng">
<FRONT>
<DIV1 TYPE="title page">
<PB REF="1">
<PB REF="1" MS="y">
<P>A Mu&s;ick-Lector: OR, The Art of MUSICK (that is &s;o much vindicated in <HI>Chri&s;tendome</HI>) Di&s;cour&s;ed of, by way of Dialogue between three men of &s;everal Judg|ments:</P>
<P>The one a MUSICIAN, and Ma&s;ter of that Art, and zealous for the Church of <HI>England;</HI> who calls Mu&s;ick <HI>The gift of God.</HI></P>
<P>The other a BAPTIST, who did affirm it to be <HI>a decent and a harmle&s;s practice.</HI></P>
<P>The other a QUAKER (&s;o called) being for|merly of that Art, doth give his Judgment and Sentence again&s;t it; but yet approves of the Mu&s;ick that plea&s;eth God.</P>
<P>Written by SOLOMON ECCLES.</P>
<Q>Wo to them that are at ea&s;e in Sion, to you that put far away the evil day, and cau&s;e the &s;eat of violence to come near; to them that lie up|on Beds of Ivory, and &s;tretch them&s;elves upon their Couches, and eat the Lambs out of the flock, and the Calves out of the &s;tall: That chant to the &s;ound of the Viol, and invent to them&s;elves In&s;truments of Mu&s;ick like David: That drink Wine in Bowls, and anoint them|&s;elves with the chief Ointment: but they are not grieved for the Afflictions of Jo&s;eph.
<BIBL>Amos 6. 1, 3, 4, 5, 6.</BIBL></Q>
<P><HI>London,</HI> Printed in the Year, 1667.</P>
</DIV1>
</FRONT>
<BODY>
<DIV1 TYPE="dialogue">
<PB REF="2" MS="y">
<PB N="3" REF="2">
<HEAD>A Mu&s;ick Lector: <HI>OR,</HI> The Art of <HI>MUSICK</HI> that is &s;o much vindicated in <HI>Chri&s;tendom,</HI> di&s;cour&s;ed of by way of Dialogue, between three men of &s;everal judgments.</HEAD>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu&s;itian.</SPEAKER>
<P>WEll Friend, we under&s;tand that all men in <HI>Chri&s;tendom</HI> generally do acknowledge <HI>Mu&s;ick</HI> to be a plea&s;ant and heavenly harmony, which delights the ears of all the No|bility, both Kings, Princes and others, yet all will not do; for there be &s;ome men are quite again&s;t it. But O how no|tably did the Gentleman handle the matter in this <HI>Mu&s;ick Lector</HI> for the vindication thereof, but all will not do.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bapti&s;t.</SPEAKER>
<P>Why, who are they that can &s;peak again&s;t this harmle&s;s Calling in the practice of Mu&s;ick? is there any think you?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu&s;.</SPEAKER>
<P>Yes; for yonder goes a man, was once a Ma&s;ter of <HI>Mu|&s;ick,</HI> and a very hone&s;t man once; but now he's turn'd <HI>Quaker:</HI> Prethee Friend let's know his ground and rea&s;on for it, and let's &s;ee what principle they hold.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Friend, beware; for <HI>Quakers</HI> hold dangerous tenets.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu&s;.</SPEAKER>
<P>Pray what dangerous tenets do they hold, that we may beware of them: we mu&s;t not accu&s;e them before we hear them; pray will you in&s;tance.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Why one of their dangerous tenets is, <HI>That a man may be perfect and free from &s;in on this &s;ide the grave:</HI> and another is, <HI>They deny Ordinances, or the two Sacraments, the Bapti&s;m of Water, and Bread and Wine:</HI> and another is, <HI>That a man may fall away after he believeth.</HI> Tho&s;e are horrid tenets.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu&s;.</SPEAKER>
<P>The&s;e are &s;trange tenets indeed. However, he's my old Acquaintance, let's venture now we have an opportunity, though I &s;hould have been afraid to have ventur'd alone; but you being
<PB N="4" REF="3"> with me, I do not que&s;tion but we &s;hall convince him of his error: how think you?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>We &s;hall but trouble our &s;elves with him: for there is nothing but <HI>thee</HI> and <HI>thou;</HI> they are the unmannerlie&s;t people that ever came.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu&s;.</SPEAKER>
<P>Peace a little. <HI>Your humble Servant, Sir; I am glad to &s;ee you well.</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Quaker.</SPEAKER>
<P>Leave off thy deceit, <HI>P&s;al.</HI> 10. 7.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Truly Sir, I am very joyful to &s;ee you, for I have not &s;een you of a long time.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>Mind the Witne&s;s of God in thee, <HI>John</HI> 1. 5, 9.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>You &s;ay very well, Sir; but what do you mean by the Wit|ne&s;s of God, what is it?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>Something that God hath placed in thee, which bears witne&s;s for God; <HI>Acts</HI> 14. 7.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But what do you call this Witne&s;s of God?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>He that witne&s;&s;eth for God in every man, is Chri&s;t; <HI>Rev.</HI> 1. 5.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But is Chri&s;t within a man; how can that be? for he is glorified with the Father in Heaven: what &s;trange doctrine do you preach?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Search and try thy own &s;elf: for, <HI>knowe&s;t thou not how that&punc; Je&s;us Chri&s;t is in thee, except thou be a Reprobate?</HI> 2 Cor. 13. 5.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>You are right for that indeed. But why do you bid me leave off my deceit; for what deceit can you charge me with?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Yes: for the fir&s;t word thou &s;pake&s;t was deceit and vain; for thou &s;aid&s;t, <HI>Your humble Servant, Sir,</HI> and thou wa&s;t never my Servant: for when did I ever &s;et thee at work, and thou wa&s;t my humble Servant? Mu&s;t thou not give an account for every idle word? be&s;ides, <HI>he that respects mens per&s;ons, commits &s;in;</HI> Jam. 2. 9.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But you know it is our cu&s;tom in <HI>England</HI> &s;o to do; and you have done &s;o your &s;elf to my knowledge.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>I do confe&s;s that I was in the dark, and had mens per&s;ons in admiration: but now the true Light is come which reproves for tho&s;e things, glory be to the Lord for ever. And <HI>what&s;oever makes manife&s;t is Light, Eph.</HI> 5. 13.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But methinks you do not &s;peak like other men; for I ne|ver heard of the <HI>Light within</HI> till you Quakers came.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<PB N="5" REF="3">
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Turn to it now, and be obedient, and it will bring thee out of the fall, and deliver thee from de&s;truction and perdition; 2 <HI>Tim.</HI> 6. 9.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Why our Mini&s;ters and Fathers of the Church of <HI>England,</HI> are the true Mini&s;ters of Chri&s;t no doubt; yet they do not bid men turn to the Light within, as you <HI>Quakers</HI> do.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Fathers of the Church of <HI>England,</HI> we grant they are, and &s;ome of them Mini&s;ters of the Letter al&s;o; but if thou could&s;t prove them the Mini&s;ters of Chri&s;t, thou would&s;t do them great &s;ervice; for they cannot prove it them&s;elves: and they dare not for &s;hame &s;ay that they are Mini&s;ters of Chri&s;t, becau&s;e they re|ceive the wages of unrighteou&s;ne&s;s; <HI>Jude</HI> 11.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Pray good Sir give me favour; mu&s;t we not acknowledge them to be the Mini&s;ters of Chri&s;t who preach the Go&s;pel, and prove their Mini&s;try by Scripture?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>The Scriptures prove no man a Mini&s;ter of Chri&s;t, but he that is called of God, and cho&s;en for that work; <HI>Rom. 1. 1. 1 Cor. 1. 1. 1 Pet. 1. 1. 2 Pet.</HI> 1. 1. The&s;e were not of men, nor by men, but by Je&s;us Chri&s;t and God the Father, <HI>Jam. 1. 1. Gal.</HI> 1. 1.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Lord ble&s;s me! why is not the Scripture the Word of God, and a Rule for men to walk by? and do they not fetch all their Proofs from Scripture? and all their building is on the Scripture&punc; therefore we hear them: For they that are of God do hear God's Word, do they not?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>Yea, they that are of God do hear God's Word: but we cannot hear them, becau&s;e they preach not God's Word, becau&s;e they &s;tand not in God's Coun&s;el, as &s;aith the Lord to <HI>Jeremi|ah</HI> concerning the Prie&s;ts: For, <HI>if they had &s;tood in my Coun&s;el,</HI> &s;aith the Lord, <HI>they &s;hould have taught the people my Word, and have turned them from their evil wayes, and from the evil of their doings.</HI> Mark, they that are Mini&s;ters of God's Word, do turn people from their evil wayes, and from the evil of their doings. <HI>Jer:</HI> 23. 22. And it is my Faith for ever, and I'le give my Voice for it, that they are the true Mini&s;ters of Chri&s;t, <HI>that turn people from darkne&s;s to Light, and from the power of Satan to God.</HI> Act. 26. 28.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>I mu&s;t confe&s;s our Mini&s;ters are great Scholars as <HI>Oxford</HI> and <HI>Cambridge</HI> can afford, and we look upon &s;uch to be the Mini|&s;ters of the Go&s;pel and none el&s;e; but yet I cannot &s;ay they turn
<PB N="6" REF="4"> people from their &s;ins: But pray are there no true Mini&s;ters of Chri&s;t but they?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>Nay, none can be &s;aid to be Mini&s;ters of Chri&s;t, but &s;uch as turn people to the Lord.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Why who then did &s;end them? came they of them&s;elves?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P><HI>I never &s;ent them,</HI> &s;aith the Lord, <HI>yet they run: but they &s;hall not profit the people at all;</HI> Jer. 23. 22.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Truly I think they have been much better than they are now.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>Yea, they have lo&s;t their Courage, their Faith, and their Zeal; and &s;ome of them have &s;pued up the <HI>Common-Prayer-Book</HI> in their Zeal; but now they have (many of them) lickt it up again. See what the Prophet calls &s;uch, <HI>I&s;a.</HI> 56. 10.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Indeed our Mini&s;ters do love their bellies too well to be the Mini&s;ters of Chri&s;t. Truly Friend, I cannot &s;peak much for them: I &s;ee they feed their flock but &s;paringly, but them&s;elves they feed without fear I think, for they grow in belly amain: but what &s;hall I &s;ay, when &s;uch men as they go wrong, what &s;hall be|come of me that am a &s;inner?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>Believe in the Light that &s;hines in thy heart; for that Teacher will never deceive thee, but will make thee wi&s;er than all thy Teachers; <HI>P&s;al.</HI> 119. 99, 100.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Your coun&s;el is good: but me-thoughts you were a very hone&s;t man and &s;trict before you were a <HI>Quaker;</HI> if I were &s;o, I &s;hould de&s;ire no more.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>I had a Zeal, but not according to Knowledge; and all that I have given up to the Bats and to the Moles; &s;uch as come not forth to look on the Sun, for fear of per&s;ecution. <HI>Joh. 10. 1. 1 Tim. 2. 3, 12. I&s;a.</HI> 2. 20.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>'Tis good to avoid Per&s;ecution as near as we can, for the Scriptures advi&s;e us &s;o to do.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>The Thief and the Robber would climb up &s;ome other way; but <HI>all that will live godly in Chri&s;t Je&s;us &s;hall &s;uffer Per&s;ecution.</HI> 2 Tim. 3. 12.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But Chri&s;t &s;ayes, <HI>If they per&s;ecute you in one City, flee into another.</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Before the Holy Gho&s;t was given, which was the promi&s;e of the Father, they were more in fear, and in the Childs &s;tate, till
<PB N="7" REF="4"> our Lord and Ma&s;ter was offered up for a pattern to them; then the &s;ame Spirit of Chri&s;t came into them, and made them of the &s;ame mind for holy boldne&s;s and courage; and, <HI>they loved not their lives to the death;</HI> and <HI>as Chri&s;t &s;uffered in the fle&s;h, they do arm them&s;elves with the &s;ame mind. 1 Pet.</HI> 4. 1.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Well: but my Friend I have &s;omething el&s;e to &s;ay to you, and I will leave the&s;e things to my Friend here, who is better able to an&s;wer you than I can. But pray let me ask you one que&s;tion.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>U&s;e thy freedom.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Why did you for&s;ake and di&s;pi&s;e &s;o harmle&s;s a Calling and Practice in the Art of <HI>Mu&s;ick</HI> as you have done? Be&s;ides, you burnt and brake many good In&s;truments of Mu&s;ick, and burnt your Books of great price and value? and why did you burn and break them at <HI>Tower-Hill?</HI> I thought to tell you of it, for it was an injurious thing, to make our Calling contemptible. And it is well known that <HI>Mu&s;ick is the gift of God,</HI> and an honourable pra|ctice. I wonder you were not a&s;hamed; a man that lived &s;o well and civilly, to go and ca&s;t off &s;uch a Livelihood, who maintained your Wife and Family very well and in good order; and it is very probable, if you had continued, you had been of great e&s;teem at this day.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>I have found out the true Teacher, who teaches the be&s;t Mu&s;ick that ever any did learn; who for rarity and skill out-&s;trips all that ever had a name; and &s;uch Mu&s;ick as takes in the ears of God him&s;elf. <HI>Jer.</HI> 9. 24.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Lord ble&s;s me! is there &s;uch a rare Mu&s;ick-teacher among the <HI>Quakers?</HI> I have heard indeed, that the <HI>Quakers</HI> will come together in one place, and &s;it an hour, two or three, and not &s;peak a word one to another, except &s;igh, groan or weep; do you call this good Mu&s;ick?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Pray Friend, what ground of Scripture have you to come together, where &s;ome do &s;igh and groan, and &s;ome do weep. What Edification is there in this dumb &s;how?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P><HI>The Spirit breathes in whom it listeth, and thou mayest hear the &s;ound thereof, but knowe&s;t not from whence it comes, nor whither it goes,</HI> John 3.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Did you ever hear &s;uch Non&s;en&s;e as this man &s;peaks? what &s;trange &s;tuff is this? did I not tell you, Sir, what Non&s;en&s;e we &s;hould have?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<PB N="8" REF="5">
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>Are the Scriptures Non&s;en&s;e?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Hold, hold, my Friend, and be not offended at him, for he hath &s;poke Scripture; only &s;ome Tran&s;lations do much differ.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>All that I grant is true: but what Scripture hath he to prove that Silent-meeting is a Wor&s;hip of God?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>The three Friends of <HI>Job,</HI> when they beheld what mi&s;ery he lay in, they lift up their voice and wept, and rent their cloaths indeed, and &s;at down on the ground with him, <HI>but &s;pake nothing one to another for &s;even dayes, and &s;even nights;</HI> Job 2. <HI>la&s;t.</HI> yet I do not bring this as a proof.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Indeed it was a long time for men to keep &s;ilence; <HI>&s;even dayes and &s;even nights, and not &s;peak a word!</HI> there was never &s;uch a thing done in our days I mu&s;t confe&s;s; but <HI>Job</HI> was a patient man.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>I would ask thy Friend one Que&s;tion, and if he be free to an&s;wer me, then the thing will appear more plain.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>I'le warrant hee'l an&s;wer you, for he is an able man; and though he and I do differ I mu&s;t confe&s;s in judgement, yet I know he is able to an&s;wer you; for he is a <HI>baptized per&s;on,</HI> and &s;tands for the vindication of Bapti&s;m and the Lord's Supper, which are the Ordinances of God.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>And I al&s;o &s;tand in the defence of the holy Truth of God, which was once delivered to the Saints, <HI>Jude</HI> 3.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Well, Friend, what's your Que&s;tion?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>Who is it that tempts men to &s;in, and to di&s;obedience?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>That is &s;oon an&s;wered: for he that tempts men to &s;in, is the Devil.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>Thou ha&s;t rightly an&s;wered; for God tempts no man to &s;in, neither is he tempted of any: <HI>but every man when he is tempted is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed; and when lu&s;t hath con|ceived, it brings forth &s;in; and &s;in when it is fini&s;hed, brings forth death.</HI> Jam. 1. 14, 15.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>All that is true; you have an&s;wered your &s;elf.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>Then this is the Que&s;tion: By what means? is it by a vocal voice, or outward &s;ound that he teaches men to &s;in?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Nay I do believe that the Devil is a &s;pirit, and doth not teach men to &s;in by per&s;onal appearance, or by a vocal voice that may be heard by the outward ear.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Then we mu&s;t all conclude, that he teacheth invi&s;ibly and
<PB N="9" REF="5"> in &s;ilence, if not by voice nor per&s;onal appearance to the outward eye, nor outward ear; and by this methinks you &s;eem to ju&s;tifie the Quakers <HI>Silent-meetings.</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>We ask no favour of him nor thee, nor any man living, to wor&s;hip our God; neither any mans coun&s;el or approbation whe|ther we are in the right Wor&s;hip or no, but by way of Argument, becau&s;e the Wor&s;hippers in <HI>England</HI> do wonder and gaze &s;o much at us in our Silent-meetings. Now if the Devil do teach his to lye and &s;wear by an evil &s;pirit, who is the father of all lyars; how much more may the true God, who is ble&s;&s;ed for evermore, teach his, and lead his into all Truth? as it is &s;aid, <HI>and they &s;hall all be taught of God, I&s;a.</HI> 53. 13. and in &s;ilence, as to the outward ear, the enemy of mans Salvation, teacheth his all ungodline&s;s; may not the Lord, that good Spirit, teach his in &s;ilence, to deny all ungodli|ne&s;s and worldly lu&s;ts? And as thou ha&s;t &s;aid, and ha&s;t &s;aid true, That the Devil is a &s;pirit, and comes not to man to &s;peak to him by per&s;onal appearance, or a vocal voice to mens outward ear, but yet he layes baits before the eyes of their minds, and &s;nares, to murder and to commit Adultery, to &s;teal and rob, over-reach, cheat and cozen: and may not the Lord teach his to do to all men as they would be done by? For, where I my &s;elf had done wrong before Conver&s;ion came; the Spirit of Truth brought it to my remem|brance again, where I had over-reacht and cheated, and made me to make re&s;titution again [this teaching I witne&s;s] and made me pay back again many a pound, and that with advantage al&s;o. Oh! I commend the teaching of the Spirit above all teachings. O glory be to his Name for ever, <HI>Exod. 22. 3. Numb.</HI> 6. 7.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Well, but my Friend I cannot pa&s;s you by any longer; pray let me know why you for&s;ook &s;o good a Calling?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>While I was taught of men, I could follow it: (<HI>viz.</HI>) When the Church of <HI>England</HI> was govern'd by Epi&s;copal Order, I could follow it, and call'd it <HI>the gift of God;</HI> and when I became more &s;trict, a <HI>Presbyter,</HI> I made a trade of it, and never que&s;tion'd it at all: and after that I became an <HI>Independant,</HI> I could follow it&punc; and when I came further, and was <HI>baptized with water,</HI> and eat <HI>Bread and Wine</HI> with them about the year 1642. they encouraged me in it, and &s;ome of them had their Children taught on the <HI>Vir|ginals:</HI> but I went further, and was an <HI>Antinomian</HI> (&s;o called) and
<PB N="10" REF="6"> then I could teach mens Sons and Daughters on the Virginals and on the Viol, and I got the two la&s;t years more than an hundred and thirty pounds a year with my own hands, and lived very high, and perceived that the longer I followed it, the greater in-come I had: but when Truth came, I was not able to &s;tand before it, the Lord did thunder grievou&s;ly again&s;t this practice; and I would fain have pleaded the harmle&s;ne&s;s of it, but no pleading would &s;erve, it was nothing but vanity, and vexed the good Spirit of God: O it was hard to fle&s;h and blood to give it up, for it was not only my live|lihood, but my life was in it: Now the Witne&s;s of God did often &s;mite me for it, before I could yeeld to the Lord to give up, &s;o that &s;ometimes it put me to a &s;tand, and then rea&s;onings aro&s;e whether it was a lawful Calling; and while I with the wrong thing &s;trove to prove it lawful, that pure thing that was &s;ent of God, it took away my peace from me. O the goodne&s;s and forbearance of the Lord to me! for, what was I that the Lord &s;hould &s;trive &s;o with me le&s;t I &s;hould have gone on to my everla&s;ting de&s;truction? Then was I at a &s;tand what I &s;hould do for a livelihood; but the Holy-One caught hold on me, and &s;aid, <HI>Am not I al&s;ufficient? give up, for I have a great work for thee to do.</HI> But my life was &s;o much in the thing, that he made me to feel his &s;harp Sword, which divided between me and my lovers.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But Friend, you undervalue Mu&s;ick too much; 'tis true, that if in ca&s;e you had been a Fidler, it had been no great matter if you had ca&s;t it off: but to teach mens &s;ons and daughters on the Virginals and on the Viol, it is as harmle&s;s a Calling as any man can follow: How &s;ay you, Sir?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Truly I do not &s;ee but he might have followed it &s;till as he u&s;'d it; and as you &s;ay, me thinks it is a very harmle&s;s Calling; there is &s;ufficient proof of Scripture for the lawfulne&s;s thereof: on|ly in this one thing the <HI>Quakers</HI> mu&s;t be &s;ingular.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>I have heard divers men, and &s;ome of all Religions, and almo&s;t all people, e&s;pecially tho&s;e of the Univer&s;ities, do highly commend Mu&s;ick: but O the Truth, the Spirit of Truth, nor the Children of Truth can never bear it; but Truth and her Children do trample it under foot; 'tis <HI>Babylons</HI> Mu&s;ick, and down it mu&s;t and &s;hall for ever. And &s;ince I through the good hand of God had an eye open in me to &s;ee where I &s;tood, I &s;oon &s;ided with the
<PB N="11" REF="6"> Truth, and &s;tood off from the rea&s;oning part, and then the Zeal of God ro&s;e up as hot as fire, and I greatly loathed my &s;elf to &s;ee what cur&s;ed ground I &s;tood in, and I reckon it a happy day that I was redeemed out of a vain practice; <HI>Acts</HI> 19. 19.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But prethee thou mad <HI>Quaker</HI> hold a little, for thou wre&s;ts the Scriptures, as many of you do, to your own de&s;tructions: for, they were <HI>Magicians,</HI> not <HI>Mu&s;icians,</HI> that burnt their Books of great price.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>That which taught them, taught me to deny ungodline&s;s, and will teach all that will turn to it, <HI>to deny ungodline&s;s and curious Arts,</HI> and is not Mu&s;ick a curious Art, wilt thou deny it?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Tis true, Mu&s;ick is a curious Art, but will you &s;ay 'tis <HI>ungodli|ne&s;s?</HI> take heed what you &s;ay, le&s;t you pull an old hou&s;e upon your head: for we are no <HI>Fidlers,</HI> but are &s;ober men, and in a &s;ober Cal|ling, and that which delights the ears of Kings and wi&s;e men, and grave &s;age men, and the honourable&s;t men and women in the Na|tion do highly e&s;teem of Mu&s;ick.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>That which is highly e&s;teemed among&s;t men, is abomi|nation to the Lord, reade <HI>Luke</HI> 16. 15. And why do&s;t thou make &s;uch a difference between tho&s;e called <HI>Fidlers,</HI> and you who call your &s;elves <HI>Mu&s;icians?</HI> for my own part, &s;ince I came to the Truth it &s;elf, I do &s;ee indeed that I being a Teacher in Mu&s;ick, it might have this &s;tile above the other; for I count it was a civil Devil, and the <HI>Fidler</HI> more prophane, but both are for the Lake that pra|cti&s;e it, except they do repent, <HI>Mat. 9. 23. Rev.</HI> 18. 22.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Are they for the Lake! I think you are for the Lake more likely. But prethee Friend let me ask thee one Que&s;tion more.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>Speak on.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Doth not the Scripture &s;ay, <HI>I will have mercy, and not &s;a|crifice?</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>Yea, and it is a precious &s;aying: happy are they that can receive it and under&s;tand what it means.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Then truly if I had been your Coun&s;ellour, you &s;hould never have burnt your Books, nor brake and burnt your In&s;tru|ments: for, if you could not for con&s;cience &s;ake have followed this Calling, then I &s;hould have advi&s;ed you to &s;ell them, and to have given the money to the Poor: How &s;ay you, Sir, had not that been better?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<PB N="12" REF="7">
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Yes truly in my judgement it had, for then &s;ome body would have been the better for it.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P><HI>To obey the Lord. is better than to give all my goods to the poor, and my body to be burned;</HI> yet to let thee know the Truth of this thing; when I came to be convinced of this everla&s;ting truth, I &s;aw my Calling would not &s;tand before it; I went, but not in the Coun&s;el of the Lord, and &s;old mo&s;t of my In&s;truments; howbeit that would not cover me, for the Lord met with me; and as I was learning to &s;ew, for I had formerly &s;ome in&s;ight of a Tailors Trade, but I was too high to bow to it, till the Truth came, and that is of power to make the &s;trong man bow, and I &s;itting alone, with my mind turned in, the Voice of the Lord &s;aid, <HI>Go thy way, and buy tho&s;e In&s;truments again thou lately &s;olde&s;t, and carry them and the re&s;t thou ha&s;t in thy hou&s;e to</HI> Tower Hill, <HI>and burn them there, as a Te&s;ti|mony again&s;t that Calling.</HI> So I obeyed the Lord, and bought them again, and carried them, and all I had in my hou&s;e, to <HI>Tower Hill,</HI> and burnt them there, according to the uprightne&s;s of my heart be|fore the Lord; which Books and In&s;truments did amount to more than four and twenty pound; and I had great peace. Glory be to God for ever. <HI>Amen.</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But might it not be a delu&s;ion, and fal&s;e motion? were you never &s;orry for what you have done in this thing?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Yes, I was very &s;orry that when I had brought them to <HI>Tower Hill,</HI> and had begun to &s;et them on fire, and when the fire flamed upon them, the rude multitude would not &s;uffer me to burn them, but put the fire out; &s;o I was forced to &s;tamp upon them, and break them to pieces; for I did it with much indignation, though my Father, and Grandfather, and Great-grandfather were Mufitians, yet he that was before &s;in was, taught me to do as I did; but I was &s;orry that I could not be avenged on them as I would; but the Lord did accept of it, and I had great peace: And if at this time I had as many as would amount to a thou&s;and pound of In|&s;truments and Books for that purpo&s;e, to the fire they &s;hould all go; for the &s;ame indignation is with me &s;till again&s;t that practice, as again&s;t lying, and &s;tealing, and committing adultery: yet there is &s;omething in Mu&s;ick, but there is a difference between the Harps of God, and the Harps of Men; as there is a difference between the Natural man, and the Spiritual, 1 <HI>Cor.</HI> 2. 14.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Well, but my Friend, I mu&s;t tell you what the Judge|ment
<PB N="13" REF="7"> of wi&s;e men hath been in this your perver&s;e proceedings, for you were then di&s;tracted &s;ure enough, and it was a very great delu&s;ion of the enemy, to per&s;wade you from &s;o good a Calling; and this they &s;ay further, That if the truth were known, you have been &s;ufficiently &s;orry for it &s;ince; and &s;ome do verily believe, that you will be glad to follow it again, if you can but get an oppor|tunity; and truly as my old acquaintance, I could wi&s;h that you would follow it again with all my heart. What &s;ay you Sir?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>God forbid that ever &s;uch a motion &s;hould enter my heart, it never did nor never &s;hall; What go back and build again the things I have de&s;troyed? I have had opportunity &s;ufficient to go back again into <HI>Egypt:</HI> But to an&s;wer the thing thou &s;pake&s;t, that if the truth were known, &s;ome &s;ay, that I have been &s;ufficiently &s;orry. Well, both thou and they &s;hall know the truth in this thing; In|deed I was &s;orry at my very heart, and to this hour it troubles me, That ever I &s;hould &s;pend &s;o much of my pretious time &s;o idely, in &s;uch a cur&s;ed practice, <HI>Acts</HI> 11. 17.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But was not <HI>David</HI> a man after Gods own heart? and he played before the Lord, and danced before the Ark. And in <HI>Solo|mons</HI> day there was Mu&s;ick in the Temple.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>What ha&s;t thou to do with <HI>David,</HI> or with <HI>Solomon</HI> or the <HI>Temple?</HI> Where are your Burnt-offerings and Sacrifices, you that plead for your Mu&s;ick &amp; Dancing, and in&s;tance <HI>David</HI> &amp; <HI>Solomon?</HI> Ye filthy hypocrites, would you have <HI>David,</HI> and <HI>Solomon,</HI> and the <HI>Temple</HI> to cover you! Behold <HI>Nebuchadnezzar,</HI> that old Idolater, who ordained, <HI>That at the &s;ound of the Cornet, Sackbut, Dulcimer,</HI> and all his gang of Fidlers, <HI>men mu&s;t bow to his Idol.</HI> And for this thou&s;and years, his Brother the Pope hath &s;et up Ma&s;s-hou&s;es, and Mu&s;ick, and Organs, and Bells, and Queri&s;ters in Idol Temples. For <HI>Pauls</HI> Church was called, <HI>The Temple of Diana.</HI> And <HI>Peters</HI> Church at <HI>We&s;tmin&s;ter, The Temple of Apollo.</HI> And in <HI>Rome</HI> they had the great God <HI>Jupiter,</HI> and in <HI>Florence, The Temple of Mars.</HI> And in other places to other Idols. Now <HI>Jupiter, Mars, Apollo,</HI> and <HI>Diana</HI> were unclean Spirits and filthy Devils. See Bi&s;hop <HI>Jewel</HI> of <HI>Sali&s;|bury,</HI> in his Treati&s;e of the holy Scriptures, <HI>Pag.</HI> 30. And in <HI>Eng|lands</HI> Idol Temples, they &s;ing <HI>Davids</HI> Lamentations, but never fol|low his Practice, <HI>P&s;al. 6. Prov. 14. 9. Dan.</HI> 3. 15.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Truly, me thinks when I go to Church, and hear the Or|gans,
<PB N="14" REF="8"> and Voyces, and the Di&s;cords, and Concords, I am even ra|vi&s;hed to hear, and I can prai&s;e the Lord with them, and tis to me as the joys of Heaven.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>That Heaven will be &s;haken, and thy Song will be turned into howling; for &s;uch Mu&s;ick and Singing was never &s;et up of God, but of men; and it takes with that part in man that &s;erves not God aright, but is for wrath and judgement, <HI>Ho&s;. 12. 26. 1 Cor.</HI> 2. 24.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Marry God forbid Friend, be advi&s;ed what you &s;ay, and take heed; for our mo&s;t learned Divines and reverend Fathers in God that we have in <HI>England,</HI> do highly approve of Mu&s;ick.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Tis never the better for that, nor they are never the better for being called of men <HI>Divines,</HI> and <HI>Reverend Fathers in God;</HI> when they Per&s;ecute the Saints, God is highly di&s;plea&s;ed with them and will give them blood to drink. But what effects hath Mu&s;ick brought forth, that men &s;o highly e&s;teem it? What fruit did <HI>Nebu|chadnezzars</HI> Mu&s;ick bring forth in his day, was it not to murder? But the three &s;ervants of the Lord would not bow to his Image at the &s;ound of his Pipes and his Fiddles, though others did. And how did Mu&s;ick and Dancing take the heart of the fooli&s;h King <HI>Herod,</HI> by means whereof he committed murder, and cau&s;ed <HI>John Bapti&s;ts</HI>'s Head to be cut off, who was a ble&s;&s;ed man, appro|ved of God, and the Lord Je&s;us Chri&s;t, and was greater than the Prophets; and becau&s;e he reproved him for having his Brothers Wife, rankor lay in the heart of the Dam&s;els Mother, and when the Fidlers did &s;trike up, and the Wench began to dance, his af|fectionate love began to be enflamed to the Girle, that he killed the Lords &s;ervant in coole blood. O ye Fidlers and Dancing-Ma|&s;ters, let this Pre&s;ident break you off from your filthy practice; Why do you dance without the Ark? Where is your Ark? What Pre&s;ident have you in Scripture for your Danceing? You &s;et up the Devils Kingdom by your proud Calling: You &s;et their Bodies in po&s;tures to enflame and take with the lu&s;tful Nature in men, and with proud Apparrel, and Spots on their Faces. <HI>Wo to the Crown of Pride.</HI> What account will ye give to the Lord, ye Dancing-ma|&s;ters, from whence came ye, where is your Ark? <HI>David</HI> danced before the Ark. O repent ye &s;hamle&s;s men, will you not blu&s;h at your doings? If my Calling was unlawful, much more is yours; O
<PB N="15" REF="8"> do not provoke the Lord any more; ha&s;te, ha&s;te, and leave off your practice before it leave you, for what thank will it be to you then, when you &s;hall break off &s;inning becau&s;e you can &s;in no more?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Truly Friend you make my heart ake, yet I have one que|&s;tion to ask you more: If our Mu&s;ick and Singing in our Churches is not of the Lord, who brought in the&s;e things?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Pope <HI>Vitellian</HI> was the man, who being a lu&s;ty Singer, and fre&s;h couragious Mu&s;itian him&s;elf, brought into the Church Prick-Song, and De&s;cant, and all kind of &s;weet and plea&s;ant melody.</P>
<P>And becau&s;e nothing &s;hould hinder the vain idle Ears of fond and fanta&s;tical men, he joyned the Organs with the curi|ous mu&s;ick, in the Year, 653. So 'tis more then a thou&s;and years ago &s;ince this Pope &s;et up Piping and Fidling in Churches, (as they Call them) as you may read in a Book called, <HI>The Re|liques of Rome:</HI> and &s;ince by Queen <HI>Elizabeths</HI> Fidlers, <HI>Thomas Sternhold, John Hopkins</HI> and others, who &s;tile them&s;elves Mu|&s;itians, the&s;e turned the <HI>P&s;alms</HI> into <HI>Meeter, Hymn</HI> and <HI>Ver&s;e,</HI> and &s;et men and women in the Idol Temples to &s;ing, and deride holy <HI>David.</HI> For one &s;ayes, <HI>I am weary of my groaning; all the night long make I my Bed to &s;wim, I water my Couch with my teares.</HI> Are the&s;e any better than mock-ver&s;es upon poor lamenting <HI>David?</HI> for they that do not witne&s;s what they &s;ay, and al&s;o witne&s;s &s;uch a State, are mockers; &s;uch as were &s;aid &s;hould <HI>come in the la&s;t dayes.</HI> For when did <HI>Tho. Sternhold,</HI> and <HI>John Hopkins,</HI> or any of them witne&s;s &s;uch a State, <HI>to water their Couch with tears, and to fa&s;t till men might tell their bones?</HI> This is no wayes con&s;i&s;tant with holy men, <HI>who wrote as they were moved by the holy Gho&s;t.</HI> And another &s;ayes, <HI>O Lord I am not puft in mind, I have no &s;cornful look:</HI> But were they not puft in mind to take upon them to turn the holy Scriptures into Poetry? and had they not a &s;cornful look? if not, why did it not content them to read the Scriptures as they were? but they had ta|ken upon them things to wonderful for them, this did not <HI>David, P&s;al.</HI> 131. 1. Wherefore, Wo to the Pope and his Cardinals, to the Monks, Friars and Je&s;uites, Bi&s;hops, Lord-Bi&s;hops, and all fal&s;e Prophets and Hirelings, with their Organi&s;ts and Queri&s;ters, Mu&s;itians and Dancers on Ropes, with their Fidlers and Pipers; Juglers, Cheaters and Gam&s;ters, Hunters and Haukers, Swearers and Lyars, Drunkards and Harlots, for all this is <HI>Babylon,</HI> her
<PB N="16" REF="9"> Maskers and Mummers; and again&s;t all this is Gods wrath gone forth from the pre&s;ence of the Lamb: Their Plague is begun.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But yet I think our Brethren, <HI>Thomas Sternhold, John Hopkins</HI> and others, did think they did well; and how could the People imagine that it was the Mu&s;itians &s;tate? but their endea|vour was to &s;hew how it was with <HI>David,</HI> and not them&s;elves.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>The People know that it was none of their condition, that's true; but what need had <HI>David</HI> of their rehear&s;al, and reading and &s;inging his condition, and to &s;ound out their Pipes, with their Or|gans and Queri&s;ters? all the&s;e Song&s;ters de&s;pi&s;e <HI>Davids</HI> practice. Then is it not Mockery and Hypocri&s;ie? <HI>Who hath required &s;uch things at their hands?</HI> I&s;a. 1. 12.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But Friend, I have not forgot that you &s;pake of a won|derful&punc; Teachet, that doth far excell all that ever had a Name.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>He whom I told thee of doth teach &s;uch Mu&s;ick that God him&s;elf will li&s;ten to: that's more than men; <HI>P&s;al.</HI> 69. 33. and 72. 12, 14.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Truly Friend, I could be glad if I could learn that Le&s;&s;on that might plea&s;e the Lord; pray what part is that which the Lord is plea&s;ed with?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>The inward part alone; <HI>I&s;a. 31. 33. P&s;al.</HI> 51. 6.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>How contrary is this to our Mu&s;ick? for if we &s;hould play the inward part alone, there is none would delight in our Mu&s;ick.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>That which men de&s;pi&s;e, and Nations abhor, the Lord doth highly e&s;teem: and that which men do highly e&s;teem, the Lord ab|hors; <HI>Luke</HI> 16. 15.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Truly Friend, I would fain learn that Le&s;&s;on that might plea&s;e the Lord; for I with others have plea&s;ed men, and they have highly rewarded us; but truly &s;ince I came to &s;peak with you, I do que&s;tion whether I have blea&s;ed the Lord in &s;o doing.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>I was once playing a part with four more, more than 30 years ago; and the parts hit with the Fuige, and came in with the Di&s;cords and Concords &s;o very lovely, that it took very much with that part which &s;tands not in unity with the Lord: So that a Ma&s;ter of Mu&s;ick being in the Room the &s;ame time, heard the parts, and took his Hat off his head, and flang it on the ground, and cryed aloud, &s;aying, <HI>Now take Body and Soul and all!</HI> This he &s;aid who
<PB N="17" REF="9"> never knew what his Soul was, nor what it would co&s;t to redeem it from de&s;truction. So I &s;ee, that Mu&s;ick plea&s;es well that which is for de&s;truction, and grieves that which God doth highly e&s;teem and honour; <HI>I&s;a.</HI> 42. 21.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Truly Sir, I am &s;omething de&s;irous to know further; Pray where dwels this Mu&s;ick-Teacher?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Come and &s;ee.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>I would gladly &s;ee him and hear him, and would go far to learn of him; pray tell me where he dwells?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>He dwells Invi&s;ible.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>How can a man learn of him that dwells invi&s;ible? you &s;peak as if you did not intend that I &s;hould know.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Yes verily, I would have thee know, and do not think it &s;trange becau&s;e I thus &s;peak, for <HI>he that &s;earcheth the heart, and try|eth the reins,</HI> is Invi&s;ible; and &s;ome there be that learn of him, <HI>Jer.</HI> 17. 7.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Tis true, I know that we mu&s;t all be taught of God, but that is not the que&s;tion now; but if you will not tell me where he dwells, then tell me his name, that I may find him out. What call you his Name?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>His Name is called, <HI>The Word of God,</HI> Rev. 19. 13.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>What a &s;trange man are you, what an An&s;wer is this, why do you an&s;wer &s;o cro&s;ly? I took you for a wi&s;e man once, but are you not now turned fool? But I have heard of &s;uch a Name; well if his Name be called, <HI>The Word of God,</HI> it is a far better Name in my opinion, than <HI>Solomon the King:</HI> but I hope you will not be an|gry, for <HI>Quakers</HI> do not u&s;e to be angry.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Nay I am not angry with thee one whit, for thou ha&s;t &s;poke the Truth; and there is witne&s;s born both in Heaven and in Earth to this Name: for he who&s;e Name is called, <HI>The Word of God,</HI> is a far more excellent Name then <HI>Solomon the King; for every Name and power in heaven and earth, &s;hall bow,</HI> and mu&s;t bow to this <HI>Name.</HI> Read <HI>Acts 4. 12. Phil.</HI> 2. 4, 10.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But pray Friend, doth he prick Plain-Song or Intableture? for if he prick Plain-Song, I do not fear but I &s;hall learn it.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>He pricks very plain; for every Note is as ea&s;ily &s;een as a white Sembrif or Minnom, <HI>John</HI> 16. 15.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Truly I am glad to hear that you <HI>Quakers</HI> &s;peak comforta|bly
<PB N="18" REF="10"> &s;ometimes, though it is but &s;eldom; it joys me much, for now I hope I &s;hall learn that Le&s;&s;on that God is well plea&s;ed with. But where doth he prick his Notes?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>He pricks at the Heart, and brings his pure Light into the Con&s;cience, that thou and all the men and women in the world may read; yea, that they that run on in their wickedne&s;s may read; becau&s;e the Book of Con&s;cience is open that all men may &s;ee how 'tis with them, and may come to &s;ee who they have pierced. And thus men begin to mourn their parts, and their wives apart; and this takes more in the ears of the Lord, than all the <HI>Babyloni&s;h</HI> Wor&s;hip and Mu&s;ick in the world, <HI>Acts 2. 37. Zech. 12. 12. Mat.</HI> 5. 4</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Now wo is me, is it come to this; my hopes are fru&s;tra|ted; Is there no way but I mu&s;t come in at this door? Well, I do perceive that the <HI>Quakers</HI> preach not for gold nor &s;ilver, for if you did you would never preach after this manner; for who can take any plea&s;ure in this Doctrine? I &s;ee now what you drive at; for when <HI>Peter</HI> preacht to the <HI>Jewes,</HI> he told them, that they <HI>had mur|dered and betrayed him whom God had made both Lord and King: And when they heard this, they were pricked at their hearts: crying out; Men and Brethren, what &s;hall we do?</HI> Truly I do believe there be but few Mu&s;itians that ever learnt this Le&s;&s;on.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Mind the gift of God in thy heart; Chri&s;t Je&s;us the true Teacher; and prize thy pretious time, that it may be ble&s;&s;ed to thee; remember how that he hath waited on thee long. O prize the long-&s;uffering of the Lord, for it is high time for thee now to return, <HI>Rom.</HI> 2. 4.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Would to God I were of any other Calling; for I verily be|lieve that God will overthrow all plea&s;ant things, and all fal&s;e Wor&s;hip: I am &s;orry I have lived &s;o vainly.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>I could like the <HI>Quakers</HI> well, if they did not de&s;pi&s;e the Ordinances; as Water-Bapti&s;me, and Bread and Wine which are the two Sacraments.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Who gave you <HI>Bapti&s;ts</HI> Commi&s;&s;ion to Baptize men and wo|men with Water? God never &s;ent you, yet you run; but God &s;ent <HI>John</HI> to Baptize with Water, and &s;ome of his Apo&s;tles did it in their freedom; and who gave you Commi&s;&s;ion to eat Bread and to drink Wine? The Lord Je&s;us gave it to his Di&s;ciples; but who&s;e Di&s;ciples are you? Ye plea&s;e your belly, and your Faith is of
<PB N="19" REF="10"> things that are &s;een; <HI>but we look not at the things that are &s;een, for they are Carnal; but the things that are not &s;een are Eternal:</HI> But Bread, Wine and Water are &s;een. No marvel that you love good Bread and good Wine, and cry them up for Ordinances; but if in its place you would put bread of Affliction, and water of Affliction till he came, and come every Fir&s;t Day to eat this bread of afflicti|on, and water of affliction; you would not cry up your Ordinan|ces &s;o much as you do, neither would you have the tenth part of Communicants as you have. Are you not a&s;hamed to intrude into tho&s;e things you have no Commi&s;&s;ion for? Poor <HI>David</HI> would not meddle with things that were <HI>too high for him,</HI> P&s;al. 131. 1. But when did you <HI>Bapti&s;ts</HI> witne&s;s <HI>Davids</HI> &s;tate? <HI>My tears have been my meat day and night,</HI> P&s;al. 42. 3. And again, <HI>I have eaten a&s;hes like bread, and mingled my drink with weeping,</HI> P&s;al. 102. 9. And when did you <HI>Bapti&s;ts</HI> fa&s;t till men might tell your bones? (as &s;ome of the <HI>Quakers</HI> have done) Are you any better than Queen <HI>Eliza|beths</HI> Fidlers, that turned the holy &s;ayings of <HI>David</HI> into Meeter, Hymn and Ver&s;e? O be a&s;hamed and come to the Light, and that will let you &s;ee, how you have lept above the Life of Chri&s;t and his Di&s;ciples. Come down ye exalted Spirits, to the lowly Seed; and <HI>Learn of him that is meek and low in heart.</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Did not the Lord command his Apo&s;tles to <HI>Baptize all Nations, in the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the holy Gho&s;t?</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Yea, that he did. But who gave you Commi&s;&s;ion to Bap|tize any? Be&s;ides, you are blind Guides indeed, to go and Bap|tize with Water, and bring the Apo&s;tles Commi&s;&s;ion for it; and there was no Water at all in it. And Chri&s;t him&s;elf Baptized none with Water; for he was not &s;ent to Baptize with <HI>Water, but with the Holy Gho&s;t.</HI> And <HI>Paul</HI> was not <HI>&s;ent to Baptize with Water, but to Preach the Go&s;pel.</HI> But you <HI>Bapti&s;ts</HI> were never yet <HI>&s;lain;</HI> you ne|ver yet <HI>put on the Lord Je&s;us Chri&s;t.</HI> When did you put on his Suffer|ings and Sorrows? and how are you <HI>killed all the day? For, if you were &s;lain with Chri&s;t from the Rudiments of the World; why, as living in the World, are ye &s;ubject to Ordinances?</HI> Surely you do not believe that Chri&s;t is come, <HI>Gal.</HI> 3. 27.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Nay; We do not believe that Chri&s;t is come, though we do believe he did once come; but we look for him to come the &s;e|cond time.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<PB N="20" REF="11">
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P><HI>He that believeth not that Je&s;us Chri&s;t is come in the fle&s;h, is Antichri&s;t:</HI> and thou &s;aye&s;t, thou do&s;t not believe that Chri&s;t is come, becau&s;e thou looke&s;t not where he is manife&s;t in the fle&s;h, but thou looke&s;t for him without. And, <HI>Is not Chri&s;t in thee, except thou be a Reprobate?</HI> 1 John 4. 3. Col. 1. 27.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Doth not the Text &s;ay, <HI>Ye men of Galilee, why &s;tand ye gaz|ing up to Heaven? this &s;ame Je&s;us which you now &s;ee go into Heaven, &s;hall &s;o come in like manner as ye &s;ee him.</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Friend, Leave off thy gazing; for they were reproved that gazed: But come thou and learn of that Woman, and <HI>go &s;weep the hou&s;e, and light the Candle, that thou maye&s;t find the lo&s;t Groat, or Pearl, Chri&s;t Je&s;us,</HI> in thy heart; <HI>and be not faithle&s;s, but believe.</HI> This is in love to you <HI>Bapti&s;ts,</HI> who are loytering away your precious time, for that which never did, nor can make perfect, <HI>Acts 1. 11. Luke</HI> 15. 9.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Perfect; Why it is a very great que&s;tion to me, whether ever any man was perfect in this Life, &s;aving Chri&s;t him&s;elf; nay, or ever can be. 'Tis true indeed, you <HI>Quakers</HI> do hold &s;uch Te|nets, but I do not believe it; therefore prove it me by Scripture if you can, from <HI>Gene&s;is</HI> to the end of the <HI>Revelations.</HI> See, I have given thee the whole Bible to prove it; but you <HI>Quakers</HI> deny the Scripture.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Thou ha&s;t given me Scripture room &s;ufficient, that's true; but to &s;ay the <HI>Quakers</HI> deny the Scripture, in that thou belie&s;t the Innocent, <HI>Job</HI> 4. 7.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Well, I have given you Scripture-room enough, but I be|lieve you cannot do it; for I have &s;earched the Scriptures as well as any of you.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qua.</SPEAKER>
<P>But <HI>thou maye&s;t erre, not knowing the Scriptures; nor yet the Power of God. Noah was a Ju&s;t man, and Perfect in his Generation,</HI> Gen. 6. 9. Here was a <HI>Ju&s;t</HI> and <HI>Perfect man, approved of God him|&s;elf.</HI> And again, God gave te&s;timony of <HI>Enoch, That he plea&s;ed God, for he walked with God, and was not, for God took him:</HI> and be|fore his tran&s;lation he had this te&s;timony, <HI>That he plea&s;ed God,</HI> Gen. 5. 24. Heb. 11. 5. And again, the Lord ju&s;tified <HI>Abraham,</HI> after he had &s;aid unto him, <HI>Walk before me, and be thou perfect;</HI> and <HI>Ab|raham did &s;o;</HI> for God bore te&s;timony of him, and &s;aid, <HI>Abraham obeyed my Voice, and kept my Charge, my Commandments, my Statutes,
<PB N="21" REF="11"> and my Laws,</HI> Gen. 26. 5. Yea verily, and <HI>Abraham</HI> was called <HI>The Friend of God.</HI> And again, God bore te&s;timony of <HI>Job, That he was a perfect man, that did fear God, and e&s;chewed evil,</HI> Job 1. Now Friend, Here are four men whom God bore witne&s;s off; What ha&s;t thou again&s;t them? And <HI>David</HI> was a man <HI>after Gods own heart,</HI> and God bore witne&s;s of him that he failed in nothing &s;aving in the matter of <HI>Uriah</HI> the <HI>Hittite, 1 Kings</HI> 15. 5. And who did ever go beyond him in his repentance? Yet after this he did witne&s;s a per|fect &s;tate; For, &s;aid he, <HI>God is my &s;trength, he maketh my way per|fect;</HI> 2 Sam. 22. 33. And again, <HI>I will walk within my hou&s;e with a perfect heart,</HI> P&s;al. 101. 2. And King <HI>Hezekiah</HI> &s;aid, <HI>Lord remem|ber now, I be&s;eech thee, how I have walked before thee in Truth, and with a perfect heart,</HI> I&s;a. 38. 3. And &s;aith <HI>David, Mark the Per|fect man, behold the &V;pright; the End of that man is Peace;</HI> P&s;al. 37. 37. And again, <HI>The Lord hath not &s;een Iniquity in Jacob, nor Perver&s;ne&s;s in I&s;rael;</HI> as thou maye&s;t read, <HI>Numb.</HI> 23. 21. And again, <HI>They that are in Chri&s;t Je&s;us, are New Creatures. I in them, and they in me, perfect in one;</HI> John 17. And, <HI>Be you Perfect as your Father which is in Heaven is perfect;</HI> Mat. 5. And &s;aith the Apo&s;tle, <HI>We &s;peak wi&s;dom to them that are Perfect;</HI> 1 Cor. 2. 6. 2 Cor. 2. 11. <HI>Who &s;hall lay any thing to the charge of Gods Elect?</HI> Rom. 8. And &s;aith <HI>Paul, That we may pre&s;ent every man perfect in Chri&s;t Je&s;us,</HI> Col. 1. 28. Ephe&s;. 4. 12. Col. 4. 12. 1 The&s;. 3. 10. 2 The&s;. 3. 17. Heb. 7. 19. Heb. 10. 14. Heb. 12. 23. Heb. 13. 21. <HI>Jam. 2. 22. Jam. 3. 2. 1 Pet. 5. 10. 1 John 4. 18. Rev.</HI> 14. 5.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Truly Friend <HI>Bapti&s;t,</HI> we are all out of the way, we have &s;poke too much by hear&s;ay of them, that they do deny the Scrip|tures; I would you had not &s;aid &s;o: But I &s;ee the poor <HI>Quakers</HI> put up much wrong, for we have had very hard thoughts of them, and they have been derided, and mocked, and hated of many; in|&s;omuch that they have been puni&s;hed to death, many of them; but for my part I &s;hall be &s;ilent hereafter, for I &s;ee they have been mi&s;|repre&s;ented: And although we have &s;aid, No man can be Perfect in this Life; yet who is able to with&s;tand the&s;e &s;ound Scriptures? and I have heard many &s;ay, That a man may come to be as wicked as the Devil him&s;elf: but t<GAP DESC="illegible" RESP="UOM" EXTENT="1 letter">uly I do believe that God is above the Devil; yet I do not excu&s;e my &s;elf, for I am a grievous &s;inner, and
<PB N="22" REF="12"> never look to come to &s;uch a &s;tate, as to be Perfect in this Life.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Why no. For the righteou&s;e&s;t man that is &s;ins &s;even times a day: Yea, <HI>John</HI> him&s;elf &s;aid, he was <HI>a &s;inner;</HI> or el&s;e he would not have &s;aid, <HI>We;</HI> for the word <HI>we,</HI> implies him&s;elf as well as they. <HI>But if we &s;ay we have no &s;in, we deceive our &s;elves, and the truth is not in us.</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Do not bely the Scripture, nor the Spirit that gave it forth, <HI>for holy men wrote as they were moved by the Holy Ghost:</HI> and it no where &s;aith, <HI>That the righteou&s;e&s;t man that is &s;ins &s;even times a day.</HI> But, <HI>Stand in awe, and &s;in not.</HI> And as for <HI>John,</HI> he was a holy man, a Divine, and could not &s;in: but he wrote to Children; fir&s;t, that they might have fellow&s;hip with them who were Apo&s;tles. But they being Children, had not fellow&s;hip with them, <HI>who had fellow&s;hip with the Father, and with the Son Je&s;us Chri&s;t;</HI> becau&s;e they were &s;ubject to &s;in. And be&s;ides, Children are apt to &s;in, and to think them&s;elves better than they are; which made the Apo&s;tle &s;ay this: <HI>If we &s;ay, we have fellow&s;hip with him, and walk in darkne&s;s; we lye, and do not the truth.</HI> (Mark) For this I do affirm, That if <HI>John</HI> had &s;aid he had been a &s;inner, he had lyed; for, no &s;inner hath fellow|&s;hip with God. For, <HI>He that commits &s;in, is of the Devil;</HI> and God hath no fellow&s;hip with Devils: <HI>But he that is born of God doth not commit &s;in:</HI> And <HI>John</HI> was born of God, as he &s;aid: though he came to his own, yet his own received him not; <HI>but to as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the Sons of God:</HI> (and <HI>John</HI> did receive him:) <HI>who were born</HI> (mark) <HI>not of blood, nor of the will of the fle&s;h, nor of the will of man, but of God.</HI> Yet the Apo&s;tle did u&s;e a conde&s;cending word to the Children, in &s;aying <HI>We.</HI> But let all men take heed, <HI>how they call that common, which God hath clean|&s;ed.</HI> Yet this I &s;ay, in the truth of God, That if any &s;hall &s;ay, <HI>they have no &s;in,</HI> when Gods Witne&s;s in them doth condemn them for &s;in; they then make <HI>God a lyar,</HI> and we are all &s;en&s;ible, that God will not clear the guilty. <HI>But if we confe&s;s our &s;<GAP DESC="illegible" RESP="UOM" EXTENT="1 letter">ns, he is ju&s;t, to forgive us our &s;ins, and to clean&s;e us from all unrighteou&s;ne&s;s.</HI> And again, <HI>If we &s;hall &s;ay that we have not &s;inned, we lye, and do not the truth. But he that is born of God &s;inneth not; for his &s;<GAP DESC="illegible" RESP="UOM" EXTENT="1 letter">ed remaineth in him, and he cannot &s;in, becau&s;e he is born of God.</HI> And <HI>John</HI> &s;aid, he &s;hould have <HI>boldne&s;s in the Day of Judgement; becau&s;e, as he is, &s;o are we,</HI> &s;aith he, <HI>in this Life.</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<PB N="23" REF="12">
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>But doth not the Apo&s;tle &s;ay, <HI>We and others &s;peak after the &s;ame manner?</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Yea; for in&s;tance, <HI>James</HI> &s;aid <HI>We,</HI> as well as <HI>John; In ma|ny things WE &s;in all.</HI> But <HI>James</HI> was not in the many things, but in the one Seed, the Anointing, and could &s;in no more than <HI>John.</HI> And again he &s;aid <HI>We; For,</HI> &s;aith he, <HI>with the tongue we ble&s;s God, and with the tongue we cur&s;e men, made after the Image of God.</HI> But did <HI>James</HI> Cur&s;e men?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>God forbid. For I believe that <HI>James</HI> was a very hone&s;t man, and would not Cur&s;e men, <HI>Jam.</HI> 3. 9. But pray Friend, why did <HI>Paul</HI> &s;ay, <HI>The good that I would do, I do not; and the evil that I would not do, that do I?</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Truly Friend, that was a good &s;tate, to cry out, being un|der the &s;en&s;e of a body of &s;in; and to feel &s;in exceeding &s;inful. I verily believe there was &s;uch a day with <HI>Paul,</HI> but the Lord brought him out of that &s;tate, as he &s;aid; <HI>For the Law of the Spirit of Life, in Chri&s;t Je&s;us, hath &s;et me free from the Law of &s;in and death.</HI> 'Tis &s;o, <HI>Rom.</HI> 7. 24. &amp; 8. 2.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Bap.</SPEAKER>
<P>Why do you <HI>Quakers</HI> hold falling away? For once in Chri&s;t and ever in Chri&s;t; and &s;o &s;in pa&s;t, and pre&s;ent, and to come is done away.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>How can <HI>Bapti&s;ts</HI> fall away from the Truth, that are not come to it; or fall from Chri&s;t, who are not in Chri&s;t? For I te|&s;tifie in the Spirit of Truth, that there is as great a gulfe between you <HI>Bapti&s;ts</HI> that are not in Chri&s;t, and tho&s;e that are in the Truth, as there was between <HI>Abraham</HI> and <HI>Dives.</HI> But they that are in Chri&s;t, and do abide in Chri&s;t, are his Di&s;ciples: But they that are in him, and do not abide in him, they will be ca&s;t forth as a branch, and &s;o it withereth, and men ca&s;t it into the fire, &s;aith Chri&s;t Je&s;us, <HI>John</HI> 15. But if thou coulde&s;t make that good, That &s;in pa&s;t, pre&s;ent, and to come, is put away; thou woulde&s;t be a friend to the <HI>Ranters,</HI> and to the old Apo&s;tates; and &s;o make the &s;ayings of Chri&s;t and the Prophets of none effect: But thou and they will find it otherwi&s;e, except ye repent. And I know al&s;o, (though I bear you no malice, but wi&s;h that you may be delivered from wrath to come; and that you may come to the Righteou&s;ne&s;s of Chri&s;t, by <HI>true repentance towards God, and faith through our Lord Je&s;us Christ</HI>) there is an antipathy in you again&s;t the truth of God,
<PB N="24" REF="13"> and Gods friends, called <HI>Quakers.</HI> For in times pa&s;t I had been delivered out of Pri&s;on, had it not been for a <HI>Bapti&s;t-Chair-Man.</HI> But <HI>Paul</HI> was in the &s;ame condition, when he was <HI>Saul;</HI> for he thought verily that he mu&s;t do many things again&s;t Je&s;us of <HI>Naza|reth; which thing I did in Jeru&s;alem, and many of the Saints did I &s;hut up in Pri&s;on; and when they were to be put to death, I gave my voice again&s;t them,</HI> Acts 16. 6, 10. And this I &s;ay in the fear of the Lord, not &s;paring any, whoever they are, that are and &s;hall be found workers of Iniquity; they mu&s;t depart from him, although they may be called <HI>Quakers:</HI> yet if they go from their &s;tedfa&s;tne&s;s, and from the Truth, and become &s;uch as for&s;ake the a&s;&s;emblings of them&s;elves together, as &s;ome do and have done; &s;uch are gone from their fir&s;t Love, and have damnation: Yea, and if &s;uch do not &s;peedily return, and witne&s;s repentance, they are in danger to &s;in again&s;t the holy Gho&s;t: for &s;uch <HI>Crucify unto them&s;elves the Son of God, and put him to open &s;hame:</HI> yea, &s;uch <HI>trample under foot the Son of God, and count the blood of the New Covenant an unholy thing, by which they were &s;anctified:</HI> Notwith&s;tanding &s;uch did ta&s;te of the heavenly gift, and of the power of the world to come. Such were in the dayes of Old, who were called, <HI>The Sons of God. And the Sons of God went in to the Daughters of men, and were drowned with the wicked,</HI> Gen. 8. 2. Ezek. 16. 22. and 34. 7. Heb. 6. 6. and 10. 25, 26.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But truly Friend, 'tis pitty that &s;o many good men that are in <HI>England,</HI> and other parts, who fear God; for I am per&s;waded that there are &s;ome good men among the <HI>Bapti&s;ts,</HI> and <HI>Independants,</HI> the <HI>Presbyters</HI> and <HI>Epi&s;copal,</HI> yea and <HI>Papi&s;ts</HI> too, that are very &s;trict men, and &s;erve God in&s;tantly; and what, are they all ca&s;t away becau&s;e they are not <HI>Quakers?</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Why call'&s;t&punc; thou them <HI>good? there is none good but God,</HI> and they that are taught of God, and do hear what the Spirit of Truth doth &s;ay to them, and obey it; and &s;uch, <HI>their prai&s;e is not of men but of God.</HI> But as to the fear of the Lord, that is very precious, God will bring &s;uch to the Truth, from out of all the barren pla|ces: For, <HI>God is no re&s;pecter of per&s;ons; but in every Nation, he that feares God, and works Righteou&s;ne&s;s, is accepted of him.</HI> I &s;ay, &s;uch will God bring to his Everla&s;ting Truth, as he did <HI>Cornelius.</HI> But as for the generality of tho&s;e men thou &s;pake&s;t of, <HI>They have a zeal
<PB N="25" REF="13"> of God, but not according to knowledge;</HI> For there is one thing that God doth require, and they de&s;pite that one thing; &s;o their Pray|ers cannot be heard, <HI>Rom.</HI> 10. 2, 3.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Pray what is that One thing which makes them uncapable of acceptation? for methinks, 'tis great pitty that &s;o many good men, as I call them, &s;hould not be accepted. Surely you judge too hardly.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>I dare not daube with untempred morter; for where they are, I was; <HI>viz.</HI> in Performances, in Ordinances, in Family Du|ties, in Hearing, in Reading, in Prayers, in Fa&s;tings in my own Will, and all this was Will-Wor&s;hip: but when that One thing came which is needful, I became very poor and needy; and I do find, and therefore do te&s;tifie for God, that while men are in their natural &s;tate, they cannot plea&s;e God; nay, all men rather are di&s;|plea&s;ed at that of God in their own hearts, though they may think them&s;elves never &s;o Religious. For <HI>Paul</HI> &s;aid, <HI>That he thought ve|rily, that he was to do many things contrary to Je&s;us of Nazareth.</HI> Well, but when I came to bend my mind to that of God in me, which is Chri&s;t; his pure Law in my heart, &s;hewed &s;in to be exceeding &s;in|ful, and then I began to learn to be a fool; in&s;omuch, that I dur&s;t not give thanks for the Victuals that were &s;et before me, <HI>P&s;al. 39. 2. Rom.</HI> 7. 13.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Truly then you were unworthy of it in my judgement; for we mu&s;t give thanks and prai&s;e God for all his Benefits: Lord, what &s;ad People are you <HI>Quakers!</HI> I did never hear &s;uch a word before.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Ah Friend, Gods wayes are not like mans wayes; neither are mans teachings like unto God's teachings: for when the Lord comes, his Commandment is, <HI>Silence all fle&s;h;</HI> and that Tongue which could Preach, and Pray, and give Thanks, mu&s;t come to know a Bridle from good words, and bad words: Even as <HI>David</HI> &s;aid, <HI>I kept &s;ilence even from good words, though &s;ore again&s;t my will.</HI> For I had often prai&s;ed God with that tongue that had told Lies before Truth came; and Truth brought its Bridle and tied me up, &s;o I gave up that to the Famine, which was for the Fa|mine: and with my tongue I had often called God, Father, be|fore that was born that &s;hould call him Father; as many Pro|fe&s;&s;ors do this day; but when they &s;hall turn to the One thing that is needful, and part with all for that One things &s;ake; then the bro|ken heart will ri&s;e, then no &s;leep to the eyes, nor &s;lumber to the eye|lids,
<PB N="26" REF="14"> till that be felt born that comes to do the will of God: and be|fore this time, or about this time, men come to &s;it down and reckon what it will co&s;t them, for all is to be given up within and without; and &s;uch come in at the right door: yet were it not for the mercy of the Lord, we could never hold out, <HI>Luke</HI> 14. 28. Now we come to witne&s;s the &s;aying of the Lord Je&s;us, <HI>Without me ye can do no|thing:</HI> For indeed the way is very &s;trait, and the gate narrow, but God hath laid help upon one that is mighty, and he hath met us, to go before us: O ble&s;&s;ed be the Lord!</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But doth not the Lord &s;ay, <HI>Buy wine and milk without mo|ney and without price?</HI> Then why do&s;t thou tell us of co&s;t and char|ges? Is not the grace of God free?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Yes verily; yea, and the Te&s;timony of the Lord is true, for no gold or &s;ilver can buy the Truth; yet it is to be bought; for &s;aith Chri&s;t, who is the Wi&s;dom, <HI>Buy the Truth, and &s;ell it not,</HI> Prov. 23. 23.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>This is &s;trange Doct<GAP DESC="illegible" RESP="UOM" EXTENT="1 letter">ine, and methinks you are a &s;trange People, and your Language is &s;trange, and your Carriage &s;trange; You &s;tand much upon <HI>Thee</HI> and <HI>Thou,</HI> and <HI>Yea,</HI> and <HI>Nay.</HI></P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Come to the Witne&s;s of God in thy own particular, and thou &s;halt know the rea&s;on, why we are &s;o fearful to di&s;plea&s;e the Lord: Oh when the fear is over the heart, le&s;t we &s;hould offend with our tongue, we are &s;afe: And as for <HI>thee</HI> and <HI>thou,</HI> we had ne|ver learnt it except the Lord had taught it us, for I could willingly have &s;poken the old Language which was from the <HI>Pope, You,</HI> to a particular; but the Language of the Spirit is <HI>thou</HI> to one, and <HI>you</HI> to many, as thou maye&s;t read from the beginning of <HI>Gene&s;is,</HI> to the end of the <HI>Revelations;</HI> though I could willingly have gone miles about, than meet my old Companions to &s;peak the plain language to them. And as I was faithful in a little, the Lord made me &s;tron|ger and &s;tronger. But when I &s;aid to one, <HI>you,</HI> the Lord would &s;mite and judge me for it. And as <HI>yea,</HI> and <HI>nay,</HI> are faithfully performed in the power of the Lord, and to &s;tand faithful to it: Men will as &s;oon take our <HI>yea,</HI> or <HI>nay,</HI> as others <HI>Bonds.</HI> But the&s;e little things co&s;t me and others very dear; and whoever will be his di&s;ciple, he mu&s;t not de&s;pi&s;e the day of &s;mall things; but mu&s;t take up the dai|ly Cro&s;s and follow him. This is true, <HI>Mat.</HI> 10. 38.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Indeed I have heard in the Go&s;pel, that we mu&s;t <HI>&s;eek the
<PB N="27" REF="14"> Kingdom of Heaven fir&s;t, and the Righteou&s;ne&s;s thereof, and all other things &s;hall be added.</HI> That is a very plain Scripture; but who is able to do &s;o? Surely but very few.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Many in this day of the Lord have denyed all, and have taken up the daily Cro&s;s, and have followed him, and are well &s;a|tisfied in what they have done: Glory for ever be to the Lord, <HI>Mat.</HI> 5. 20.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>O the way to heaven is a very hard, &s;trait, and narrow way, and few there be that find it: What will become of me vile wretch?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>That which pre&s;ents thee vile in thine own eye, and in &s;e|cret reproves thee for &s;in; O love that, <HI>Rev.</HI> 3. 9.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Friend, Pray for me, for now I begin to hate my &s;elf and my Calling&punc; but how &s;hall I love that which reproves me? would you indeed have me do &s;o? how contrary is this to our Religion?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Take heed to Gods Witne&s;s, and give up to obey it, and own the indignation of the Lord, as <HI>David</HI> did, becau&s;e he had &s;in|ned again&s;t him; So the Light of Chri&s;t will let thee &s;ee thy &s;in. But believe the Light and follow the Light, and look not &s;o much at the &s;in, as at him who will &s;ave thee out of the hands of all thine Enemies: For a mans enemies are they of his own hou&s;e. But as thou minde&s;t the Light, it will judge and condemn &s;in, and rai&s;e a de&s;ire in thee to do the will of God, and thou mu&s;t have a care not quench that de&s;ire.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Truly, I think there is &s;omething in me, I cannot be at peace nor at quiet for it; and &s;ometimes I am grievou&s;ly affright|ed.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>'Tis the Witne&s;s of God; this was my ca&s;e once: Give up in obedience to him, and love his Reproofs, for the reproofs of In&s;truction is the way of Life: 'Tis &s;o, <HI>Prov.</HI> 3. 11, 12.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Well Friend, I have &s;trove much to oppo&s;e you, though in my &s;elf I have been reproved for it: for I do believe that both God and good men love the hone&s;t <HI>Quakers.</HI> But if I and all men do oppo&s;e you, yet you go on; &s;urely there is a miraculous hand upholds you, that you &s;o hold your integrity; truly Friend, I have a good mind to hear you, but I would not be &s;een.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>'Tis meet for thee to try all things, and hold fa&s;t that which is good; but thou mu&s;t not be afraid of men if thou wilt be a fol|lower
<PB N="28" REF="15"> of Chri&s;t. Take heed, <HI>and agree with thy Adver&s;ary quickly, while thou art in the way with him,</HI> and he with thee, <HI>Mat.</HI> 5. 25.</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Mu.</SPEAKER>
<P>But I have read that the Devil is my Adver&s;ary, mu&s;t I agree with him?</P>
</SP>
<SP>
<SPEAKER>Qu.</SPEAKER>
<P>Nay: Thou ha&s;t been at agreement with him too long al|ready; but thou mu&s;t agree with him that reproves thee for thy &s;in, and look well to thy precious time, while the Spirit yet &s;trives with thee, and let all people take heed of deferring their time. But hearken to his voice, <HI>while it is called to day: For now is the acceptable time, now is the day of Salvation: for Gods long-&s;uffering waits to be gracious as it did in the days of Noah.</HI> Therefore ha&s;te, ha&s;te, come out of all uncleanne&s;s, and of all fal&s;e Wor&s;hips: let all men take heed how they with&s;tand their day; for Gods Spirit will not al|ways &s;trive with men, le&s;t it &s;hould fail before him, and the &s;ouls that he hath made.</P>
</SP>
<CLOSER><SIGNED>S. E.</SIGNED></CLOSER>
<TRAILER>THE END.</TRAILER>
<PB REF="15">
</DIV1>
</BODY>
</TEXT>
</EEBO>
</ETS>
